Dante Healy [00:00:00]:

Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of business breaks. The show that discusses project management tools and techniques for success in your business. So I'm Dante Healy, and together with my friend and cohost John Byrne, we're here to discuss project delays and what do project teams and, more specifically, project managers miss during those critical times. So picture this, projects run late, but the real problem isn't necessarily what the project managers think it is. And it's not just about scope creep, resource constraints, or vendor delays. It's the decision making blind spots usually based on outdated assumptions as well as the inability to challenge those assumptions before it's too late. So why does it matter? Because projects aren't static, and business needs evolve.

Dante Healy [00:00:56]:

Assumptions will shift as you progress, and yet most project managers fail to adapt at those critical times, which leads to the impending project failure. And the cost of delays and money is also loss of credibility, team morale, and business opportunity. So, John, I guess we can talk about the first challenge or first miss usually that happens is revalidating the business case. Why do you think most project managers on a failing projects don't go back to the original business case?

John Byrne [00:01:37]:

Suppose, you know, the the the key thing is that the the business case isn't the onetime document. It should be a living document that's being constantly reviewed or at least being reviewed on regular, certainly for big projects that are going to last a while. It should evolve with the project. You know, as things change, the business case should be changed to reflect those new realities. And and when projects are delayed, you know, as you said, the biggest biggest mistake that project manager can can make is failing. One of the biggest ones is failing to reassess whether their projects don't make sense or not. And that that requires revisiting the business case and updating assumptions that may have been incorrect at the time. You know, in reality, the business case is often just it's written at the start, and it's never looked there again.

John Byrne [00:02:22]:

It once the project is approved, they move on, and they they a lot of people don't think to go back to the business case. And that means that they're they're they're walking off the assumptions they made before the project started. The the assumptions from day one, they they are walking off the end. They're not challenging them. They're not even looking at them anymore. Frequently, especially over a long con a long project, the original assumptions might no longer be true. Things have changed. Personnel have changed.

John Byrne [00:02:54]:

Priorities have changed. It's a big enough, long enough project strategies in the business overall have changed. And, you know, the the project managers, though, are are almost so focused in on their project and getting according to the project plan that that's what they're focused on. But, you know, I I don't know about you, but when I, you know, I was I was learning about project management in in in college and and even doing, you know, the various prints too and and stuff like that, That was, you know, project managers one zero one. The, the business case has to be kept under review. Like, you don't just file it away. But in practice, I rarely see project managers doing that. They rarely revisit.

John Byrne [00:03:39]:

How has your experience been? Have you have you have you yourself often revisited business cases, or have you seen other project managers dropping the ball there, or or or have you?

Dante Healy [00:03:49]:

I think it's very easy to drop a business case. Usually, at the start, there's it's it's really interesting to see what on what basis certain projects were approved because usually, it's a lot of it is based on soft benefits, the very tangible costs. So you have a robust cost plan, but you don't have anything really to challenge the benefit plan. And I think that's usually because people can see that there's a case and there's an advantage to be developed with new capabilities, but there's no way of quantifying it and being on the hook to say, if I invest £2,000,000 at the end of this three year transformation, I'll get a run rate of £8,000,000 benefit. So, therefore, you can at least say, well, net net, we are positive over time. The payback is year four or year five, and then the return on your capital, assuming borrowing costs, is x percent. So a lot of project managers aren't numbers guys. I think we're unusual in the sense we came from accounting into project management.

Dante Healy [00:05:05]:

So we like numbers. We like getting into the detail and trying to understand how the numbers feed into from the assumptions because we've we've dealt with budgets, we've dealt with plans. But a lot of people don't. And they don't have necessarily the training to revisit them and say, do they make sense? What are our costs? How are things looking and shaping as we get clearer on where this project is going. So I think there's an element of that. And then when things are failing, it becomes even more difficult, more of a challenge because it requires real courage to be transparent about exposing bad news. And so if you had to re baseline, you may find that there's not just poor planning in there, but also poor execution where you may find that actually, you know, we've been working on this project that was six months, and we're five months in. We're really at step one in the project, and we haven't progressed in those five months.

Dante Healy [00:06:07]:

And it could be down to things like poor requirements, etcetera. So there's an underlying performance issue, which may hold back, and there may be things that people would challenge the project manager on and saying, why didn't you spot that earlier? And maybe there's a fear in uncovering that. Have you seen that, John?

John Byrne [00:06:31]:

Not not so much. Not with the business case. We're we're not going back to reevaluate the the business case. You know, there is a certain amount that, you know, probably they I think it it it can be a case of their they they fear giving bad news, but not necessarily that they've done something wrong. Sometimes they can be a bit too people pleasing, But, you know, the the key issues of the business case that they they have to do, and it's and it's not all about financials either. You know, there there's unrealistic assumptions that were made about market conditions, risks. They they don't, you know, they're not necessarily financial, but but they're not revisited. The the market conditions at the beginning of the project are at the planning stage of the project.

John Byrne [00:07:17]:

The the risks that were there at the beginning of the the early part of the planning of the project and costs, as well, to both but not just the the cost. They can change during the project. They they most likely will change during the project that it's a a long term project, but they're never adapted in the business case, which means that, you know, they're unrealistic assumptions by the time you're halfway through the project that those assumptions to be working off are no longer valid, but they haven't been adopted. Why? I think it's you know, a lot of it just, they they didn't they've forgotten about the business case. I I think, you know, if you brought up, happy there's a slow match to the business case to a, project manager halfway through most projects. Especially if they're a long term project, they probably look at you and think, what business case? You know? And and I have to admit now, you you can almost understand it because they can get lost in the weeds of managing the project. You you know, there there's a other problems can be that dependencies get out. They it's that the initial timelines in the business case, you see what I'm saying? Team capacities, but the resources have shifted.

John Byrne [00:08:29]:

Now usually, when that happens, the project manager will focus on that, but they're focused on trying to fix that. They won't go back and say, well, if we can't fix it, what impact is it gonna have on the original business case? You know, probably most project managers almost see themselves at times as they're fixers. When a project is going wrong, they fix they should they figure out some way to fix it at the small scale rather than, look at the overall picture and see, well, what is this going wrong? What's what's the impact over here and the rest of the project?

Dante Healy [00:09:01]:

I guess 80%, they say what is it? 80% of project management is communication. So that only leaves about 20% for admin plus other. And I think a lot of that business case is really an administrative task, which then becomes more of a box ticking exercise rather than a strategic review of the planning on the project. And maybe it's not a big project, so it doesn't need that level of detail. But, certainly, if it's a large scale project that's multiyear, you need to be revisiting it on a regular basis. If not monthly, at least quarterly, I would say.

John Byrne [00:09:39]:

Yeah. And and or or whether it's big go, no go decisions to be made, Part of that decision is, well, redo the business case at the as at this point with the current situation and update and adapt any assumptions that had been made. And I suppose, though, you know, even when when that's built into the project planner that they they they may not want to spend too much time, Bara, because no one wants to admit the original timeline or budget no longer makes sense, especially if you're a good bit into a a into a project. And that's exactly what can come out when you redo the business case that you suddenly realize, oh, no longer makes sense. It did when we came up with it, but not now.

Dante Healy [00:10:22]:

And then you're into the sunk cost fallacy. And, really, that's a difficult one for most decision makers, like, especially if you've invested hundreds of thousands or even millions of pounds or dollars into a project, and you're realizing, hang on a minute. Are we just adding more more good money into a into a failing project? And do we think that last push will fix everything and will suddenly recover at least part of everything else that has been invested into this project. So almost like the gambler who's who continuously loses and keeps going double or nothing, double or nothing. So just like the project manager is afraid to admit failure, maybe even the sponsor is also afraid to admit failure. What do you think, John?

John Byrne [00:11:15]:

Yeah. Well, that's the, you know, the big this is definitely our accounting background coming out that the idea of sunk costs is a big accounting thing, and people who don't do accounts don't come from account backgrounds scratching their head thinking what are they talking about. So I suppose I'll just give a brief introduction to if some some costs are basically costs you've already spent, but if you've already spent them, doesn't mean you have to keep spending. It's it's good money after bad that, you know, if you've spent $1,000,000, euro, pounds, whatever you your currency is up till now, and you realize your business case is only going to bring in 1,000,000, euros worth of benefits, do you keep going with the project? Well, no. Not if you're going to have to spend another 2,000,000 to get there because then you've basically your project has completely lost money. So sunk cost the idea of sunk cost is ignore what you've already spent, look at what you still have to spend, and compare that to what you benefits you will get. And your benefits outweigh what you have to spend, then you go for it. But if your benefits don't outdo what you have to spend, then you don't go for it.

John Byrne [00:12:26]:

But you ignore the sunk cost. They're already gone. And and there's nothing you can do to get them back no matter how much more money you spend on it. Okay? You know, if if the project is not going to bring you out in, you can't do it. And that that is a classic thing that we've spent too much to stop now.

Dante Healy [00:12:42]:

Yeah. But it's good portfolio management at the end of the day if you can make the right decision because the money you're investing to keep your project running could have been reinvested on a project that would have yielded the organization benefits and more benefits.

John Byrne [00:12:58]:

Exactly. And, and and, you know, I mean, there's there are a lot of things. It does look I suppose the the optics of it can look bad to a you know, our lease approach manager feels they can look bad. If they spent this much money on a project, they then turn around and say, it's not worth it. We should cut our losses now and go. That that can seem to look bad. But to be honest, I think that's, all good, business leaders would appreciate that because, you know, business leaders will come from a you know, maybe not come from a finance background, but they will have some kind of a finance background understanding, and they'll understand the idea of some costs. So they'll probably appreciate you, you know, and that you won't look like a failure if you pull the plug on something that's that's not going to to work.

John Byrne [00:13:40]:

But, you know, project managers can be a little bit the project is their whole world. So they feel by pulling the project after spending the money, they will look like a failure. The the bigger picture that the the business leaders will be looking at, that project is just one part of it. It might be an important part, but it's still just one part. You won't look like a failure.

Dante Healy [00:14:01]:

But it all also that thing about, you know, 70% of projects fail. And, arbitrarily, that number doesn't make sense because maybe failure shouldn't be seen as a problem if you're killing something that isn't working anyway. And, again, organizationally, maybe an executive sponsor might be concerned. And, certainly, the project manager will feel personally responsible for the failure, but they needn't feel that way if the organization has the right culture. And you see in big tech companies that have grown successfully, maybe when they become more of a legacy mindset, they have all of this structure. Those with high tolerance for failure, like the early stage Googles, Amazons, Teslas, they've killed the entire product lines when they felt it no longer made sense. So they had the discipline to say, this isn't working. Let's get rid of it.

John Byrne [00:15:00]:

And then I suppose the other thing as well is where with the sunk cost and that often they have a belief that one last push will fix everything. Mhmm. And they'll they'll they'll go on it. And that kind of rolls us back a little bit to our previous thing of the business case. The idea that one last push will fix everything. Well, if you are reviewing your business case and adopting it, that will kinda give you a fair idea and and revisiting your plan that, well, maybe actually one last push won't fix everything. One last push will still fail. Just that it will have cost you more money to do that one last push in order to before you fail.

John Byrne [00:15:37]:

Also, they are quite closely related to the the some cost and the business case that, you know, to have to have the ability to recognize them. And then I suppose, yeah, you if the emotional and political investment, well, emotional is probably the biggest one on a, you know, on a lot of people saying, you don't want to admit that well, you don't want to admit it's it's failing. You know? I I was about to say you don't want to make bad decisions.

Dante Healy [00:16:02]:

You made the wrong strategic call at the start of the project before you know, imagine someone pushing for this saying, we need it. We need it. We need it. And then having to say midway through after you've poured all this money in, oh, actually, this wasn't the right thing to do.

John Byrne [00:16:18]:

But, you know, even even with that, yeah, I think you need to kinda think of these things a little bit differently and that you're you're not necessarily admitting to a bad decision. It could have been the right decision back when it was made, but circumstances have changed. Now it's not the right decision. So now you have to make the right decision and and kill it.

Dante Healy [00:16:39]:

Yeah. I mean, for example, I would say that if you're trying to promote or push for new product lines, that's one thing because you're never on you're never sure until it reaches the market. But if it's things like technical upgrades on your existing operations, They may be driven, and you may have made decisions based on technology that was recognized at the time you push for the business case. But there could be some new ground breaking technology, and you've had to now pivot and say, well, this new technology means we can deploy an upgrade, like, twice as fast or five times faster and for a lot less money.

John Byrne [00:17:21]:

That's air. Your your your rate due technology at the time, especially in a longer project because technology is moving so fast. What you're implementing could have come up to sleep. Yeah. And so, you know, but but to have the nerve and the the self confidence to admit that and say, well, it was the right decision when we made it, but now it's no longer, you know, so you're not wasting good money, resources, and time on a project that's lost the strategic value. You know, had strategic value when you started the project, but it doesn't mean it's gonna keep it for the whole duration of the project. And and, you know, yeah, it it it's a tough one. I can understand why people, especially emotionally, you get attached to them.

John Byrne [00:18:02]:

You get you almost feel it's let's take it personally.

Dante Healy [00:18:05]:

As you say, politically, it it it gives it gives ammunition for people who are competing for the same promotions as you as well, and and it does hit the optics.

John Byrne [00:18:17]:

Yeah. But, you know, the the the other side of that, I would suggest to any project managers listening who are thinking that, oh, I I it would hit the optics of why you were to say quit this project. What would be worse though? Quitting the project and moving to a more relevant strategic project or insisting on delivering this project. And then at the end when you've delivered the project, everybody kinda saying, yeah, but this is completely useless to us now. So, you know, is is delivering a useless project? I think that's worse optics, you know, in the long run. Yeah.

Dante Healy [00:18:48]:

Yeah. Well, if the business fails and you were the project manager leading that that last project that led to failure, that's pretty

John Byrne [00:18:56]:

bad. Yeah. Or or even just a project that was completely, you know, maybe it doesn't cost a failure of the company, but the the project is just pointless. Yeah. That nobody uses whatever it is that you've just done. You've just delivered that, and it's like, yeah. But it's it's no longer relevant to us. Maybe you would have been better off halfway through the project when you realize that you were doing the reviews.

John Byrne [00:19:17]:

This is not going to be relevant saying you being the catalyst and saying, this project's not gonna be relevant by the time it's delivered. Let's stop now, and let's deliver something that will be relevant when it's delivered.

Dante Healy [00:19:28]:

Completely agree, John. And I guess moving on to another piece on a late project, what you find is there's that temptation to actually let's meet the timing by throwing as many resources as we can to just crash the project and make sure we get there on time. However, Brooks Law, the idea that adding more people to a project will actually make the project later, and that's, from a book called Miracle Man Month by Fred Brooks. Why does it make it later is because you a lot of these additional resources are going to be new team members. They'll need time to be onboarded, brought up to speed on what the project's doing, organized to figure out what what their role will be in helping to move the project forward. And then all of that requires a lot of orchestration and communication overhead. So, John, what have you seen in projects where you've had to crash to try and meet the timing?

John Byrne [00:20:33]:

Well, I think, you know, as you said, a lot a lot of them just throw bodies at the the problem and hope for the best. But one of the biggest projects I was brought in, halfway through it, which was was quite delayed. I did the opposite. When I looked at the project, I looked at the original business case. I looked at the things. I focused it. And what had happened, why it was running late was because there were way, way, way too many nice to haves that had been added on. So scope creep had really creeped off that that it was being done.

John Byrne [00:21:04]:

So I took them all out, and we just delivered the the basic thing that was originally what the project was supposed to be about. And we did that without adding any more people. But what tends to happen is they'll they'll throw in a whole load more people in the hope of having enough bodies to to speed her up. I've seen that happen so many times. They could bring on more and more and more people. And oftentimes then you, you look and you, you know, I I've thankfully not been involved in those specific projects. So I, I could, I could sit back a little bit and, and look at what was happening with them because I, I, you know, they weren't part of, I couldn't interfere for various reasons. And not only did they have to spend an awful lot of time, if you said train people up, communicate and all that, suddenly the scope creep increased as well because you've you've got all these extra bodies on it.

John Byrne [00:21:56]:

And then the people who finance to who approved getting them all wanted more out of what they were getting for us since they were putting all these bodies in. And that caused even more problems, you know.

Dante Healy [00:22:09]:

Yeah. You don't know what you're getting, but the sponsor or the customer will say, well, I've given you all these additional resources. Why can't you deliver the extra pieces? And, unfortunately, there's other other pieces to that increase in resource or resource ramp up. For example, knowledge transfer, there may not be a process. There may not be good documentation. So rather than give someone a document that they can go away and read, you need someone to actually take them through. So there's a lot of meeting overhead, a lot of orchestration, a lot of alignment that needs to happen. Communication grows exponentially.

Dante Healy [00:22:51]:

And on top of that, you have the senior members of your project team being pulled away from actually doing the work that they're supposed to be doing on the project to train up these new junior team members as well. So it slows everything down dramatically.

John Byrne [00:23:07]:

That's it. And then the other the other side of things I I have seen as well is they bring in more senior people. But then the senior people spend all their time trying to figure out what the a a you know, they they've all got their own solutions, and they have to then spend an awful lot of time trying to come up with a compromise between them all. Whereas you might have been faster, you could have just left the original senior person on the now and and let let them just make that one call, and that's it.

Dante Healy [00:23:35]:

Yeah. You spend too much time pontificating on which is the optimal solution rather than looking for the the most expedient satisfactory solution, which would speed up the implementation and execution.

John Byrne [00:23:50]:

Yeah. It's a tough one, and and it is one that, again, kind of does go against logic to a certain degree and that people who haven't worked on projects. So I'm thinking project sponsors and things like that. You know, the the customers, they would probably would think that, oh, yeah. If you show loads more bodies at this problem, it'll speed up the the thing. And and and that can be how a project manager, even an experienced project manager who knows of Brooks Law, knows this is what's gonna be. They can feel put under an awful lot of pressure by the client, by the customer, by the the sponsor because that person doesn't have the experience and expects strong bodies are. So the project manager then feels, okay.

John Byrne [00:24:30]:

I need to show bodies are to satisfy them. It it's, it's it's rare that project managers have the, you know, the gravitas to be to feel empowered, to be able to go and explain to the sponsor. No. Yeah. That will be less even more. But

Dante Healy [00:24:46]:

They may have natural gravitas, but they won't have authority to suddenly pull rank and then tell the team members, hang on a minute. We're doing it this way. I'm gonna take an authoritarian view in order to meet the timing. And your opinions are valued, but we're we're taking a decision, and we have to go for what's what's the most expedient for the project to succeed. And it reminds me of Tuckman Tuckman and Group Dynamics where, you know, to stand up a project team at the start, you're going through those phases of forming, storming, norming, and performing. Right? And then when you add new team members, you're going through it all again. So it also creates those interpersonal tensions that require more soft or interpersonal team management in order to make sure that people are at least aligned and moving in the same direction.

John Byrne [00:25:45]:

Dan. And then, you know, when when it comes to dealing down with the clients and with the sponsors and things like that, it's it's, how do I say this? Well, you know, phrase it properly. The project manager is actually not a very high up person in the overall business.

Dante Healy [00:26:02]:

Mhmm.

John Byrne [00:26:03]:

They've got their project and they are the king of their the chief of their five of them with that project, But they can feel quite intimidated at a lot of time, especially a a a a newish project manager, one who's not established, who hasn't got the, you know, the the the background yet that they're building it up. So they can feel very intimidated when a, you know, a sponsor of Stormsroman tells them or a steering committee meeting, or you're running behind. Right? We're going to give you get 10 more people on that and start and get it done. That can be very intimidating for a project manager to then stand up and say, well, no. We don't need 10 more people. All we need to do is focus and and, you know, either extend the officially extend the project or limit the scope and take out some of the nice to haves and focus to get this delivered on time. It can be very intimidating to say that because the sponsor can often be somebody very senior. You could be dealing with the CFO or, or somebody like that, that oftentimes that's who the sponsors or projects are.

John Byrne [00:27:01]:

And the project manager is somebody who is, is way down the pecking order in the overall business. Just to stand up and say that to a a such as seeing a person can be intimidating. And I think that is what that can cause a lot of problems as well with with, you know, ignoring books a lot. You're just afraid to to stand up and and say, yeah. So you do what you're told.

Dante Healy [00:27:24]:

Yeah. And it's the right resources, the right type of resources. I'm not saying resource increasing resources doesn't necessarily prevent it doesn't necessarily prevent moving faster as long as your bottleneck is really about resource constraints, and it's not communication challenges. Because adding more people when your project's about communication challenges will add to those challenges.

John Byrne [00:27:51]:

That's it. And I suppose the other thing as well is for anybody who's not familiar with Brooks Law, it it is specifically about late projects becoming later if you add more people to it. If you add those people at the beginning or or halfway through the project or ever before it becomes late, that's a different story altogether because you have a bit more time to make sure everybody is up to scratch and to to redo all that. So that's fine. It is explicitly about late projects, adding more people to an already late project won't bring it on time. It will make it later.

Dante Healy [00:28:21]:

Brilliant. So thanks, John. That has been an interesting sharing of ideas. And to wrap up, should we just talk about revisit each one and talk about as a project manager, when you've got a late project, how would you address these issues to make sure that the project at least can recover and improve its chances of succeeding from failure.

John Byrne [00:28:46]:

Yep. Well, for the for the business case one, I would suggest, one one way of how to fix this, you know, have quarterly business case reviews. If if your project is gonna be finished in less than a quarter, if it's a small project, then the business case review isn't likely to be a big problem. But if you're going for it to be, you know, a longer term project, then quarterly business case reviews at least would be, you know, a a good thing. It's not too often, but your monkey bond would be, but it's it it doesn't leave things to go too late either before you know those problems. So, you know, reassess your assumptions and reassess the benefits, the cost benefits analysis, and the feasibility of the project, you know, taking into consideration all the the weather market conditions, spending what type of project there is or market conditions of whether technology has changed dramatically, which may seem to have to say that our quarterly thing. But when you think about, some of the the the jumps in technology over the last year even that and they they jumped almost out of nowhere from popping to the thing. So, you know, that's that's a key one, I think, for a business case is rebaselining and doing it transparently.

John Byrne [00:29:51]:

Adjust the scope, the timeline, the budgets, and do it open. Don't don't just react. Try to think how things are heading so that you're not just constantly reacting, reacting, reacting, that you're actually proactively making these changes by by looking ahead. And and, you know, kill points. If the project no longer makes business sense, you make a decision. Do we pivot? Do we scale back? Or do we even stop the project altogether? If if it no longer makes business sense, then, you know, I'm sure there are other projects that could do with the the resources.

Dante Healy [00:30:25]:

Yeah. I'd agree. And one thing I'd add to that is when you're rebaselining as well, show your expertise as a project manager, show that critical path and where on the critical path your rebaselining is occurring. And, also, what are the downstream means impacts to the deliverables that you have to have? So what are the the new timings, and how do you make sure that you'll meet the rebaseline plan? What's gonna be different this next time around? Brilliant. And then on sunk costs, I would say, how would you address it? You'd you go back and look at your cost benefits, reassess it, as you say, during those quarterly reviews, make sure that there's still a positive ROI, and that the project still makes sense. Try to be objective. Have a neutral external perspective when you're assessing the projects, the feasibility. So try not to get too emotionally invested.

Dante Healy [00:31:26]:

Try and be objective as much as you can on the on where the project is. And then try and also, where possible, if your organization has a culture that is tolerant of project failure for the right reasons. Right? You need to be able to say if this project makes sense. And if it's going if it's dragging the business in what you believe is the wrong direction, as long as you've got the evidence and you can show it's nothing to do with execution, it's just that the assumptions have changed and re baseline what the business should be doing in terms of project. That's a sign of good leadership and not failure. You're being transparent. You're being re you're being responsive to external factors, and you're not just plowing ahead and delivering something that won't actually deliver any value to the business at the end of it.

John Byrne [00:32:20]:

That's it. I think just on that that that, you know, the the the culture, the PMO culture, the company culture there should almost redefine what project failure is. I I I would I would suggest that delivering a project that is no longer relevant and is now useless, that's a failure. Even if you've ticked every box for what you've delivered, delivering a a a a a useless project is failure. Whereas couldn't a useless project before you wasted any more resources on it and and switching over, well, that's success. Okay. The project itself probably didn't isn't a successful it's certainly a successful project management.

Dante Healy [00:32:56]:

I agree. It's, it's interesting. Probably a lot of these projects that have succeeded have said, I completed on time, on budget, and within scope. But that doesn't necessarily mean the outcomes were delivered.

John Byrne [00:33:13]:

No. No. Exactly. But you delivered on time and on budget and on scope. It was completely useless to the company when that was delivered because something had changed. Something major had changed in the interim.

Dante Healy [00:33:23]:

Yeah. It lost its context. It lost its value.

John Byrne [00:33:27]:

Yeah.

Dante Healy [00:33:28]:

Brilliant. And then finally, revisiting Brooks law, how would you fix that?

John Byrne [00:33:33]:

Well well, as I said, then, like, the example I gave, instead of adding people, focus on removing blockers, possibly removing some of the scope creep that has happened because often that will, will, you know, be a big part of the, you know, that's a key one. Try to use parallel workflows rather than more hands on on the same task that, you know, if there's several different tasks to to try and complete things at the same time, they will eventually head to a bottleneck, or at least that bottleneck is just one rather than having several bottlenecks. Yeah. And try to reduce decision latency. So the the biggest cause of delay is is slow approvals, not necessarily lack of hands. And having more people could actually increase that because now you have more decisions to make. You know? So so that's, you know, one of the the reasons why it's not such a good idea all the time, but try to make the decisions quicker. You know, sometimes it might be better off to make a fast decision.

John Byrne [00:34:27]:

That's not. That's suboptimal rather than take an awful long time to make the perfect decision.

Dante Healy [00:34:33]:

Yeah. I think there's an art to it, and you're right. What I would add is think about what's the real root cause that's causing the project to be delayed rather than just assuming it's a resource issue. That's always the easiest answer to come to. Oh, we need more resources, and it's certainly if you're an external vendor and you're a consulting firm who's working on billable hours, there may be a temptation to say it's a resource issue because it means more more revenues, but over time, that may actually undermine your credibility as well. But, yeah, that's great. And then beyond those three ideas about what project managers miss, if you found yourself with a failing project, is there anything else you would consider worth mentioning in terms of how would you be more proactive as a project manager when you see the project is going off in the wrong direction, John?

John Byrne [00:35:31]:

I suppose that the, you know, the how how would you answer that? Yeah. I mean, you see it for failing, but the the the the key thing we we kind of mentioned that already, it's to find out the underlying cause. There has to be a a reason why it's failing. Now that reason could be the assumptions were completely wrong. It could be that the people on it weren't the right people. You know, that you you you brought in a load of programmers when in reality, you needed a load of business experts or vice versa. You know? It's to find out what the problem what what why it's failing, what the problem is. Sounds sounds obvious, sounds easy, but sometimes when you get lost in the the ticket things, you just grab anything and everything available to it.

John Byrne [00:36:16]:

You can't stand back and look at it. I have been brought into rescue projects in the past, and I've usually been successful. But one of those re the reasons for that is I haven't been emotionally attached to it. That the, I've I've been able to come in and look at the overview. So if you're the project manager and your project is failing rather than waiting for somebody else to come in and have their overview, you do a step back, leave the emotions, be and step back and look at it from a, you know, a bit of a distance and try to be it may become and it may, you know, be willing to accept that the reason the project is failing is because it's not a suitable project anymore. It may have been when you started, but it's not now.

Dante Healy [00:36:56]:

Yeah. Exactly. And that's so important, really, that critical thinking. It's not about just executing a plan. It's about adjusting your goals and being transparent about them, rather than pretending that delays don't exist and things change.

John Byrne [00:37:15]:

Yep. The the one little tip, which is kind of outside the scope of error, Tancari, now, but I will say, we we've kind of mentioned trying to, you know, problems with delayed projects, but we we, you know, the the purpose of this particular episode wasn't to discuss what the causes those delays. But one thing I will say is that as a tip to to, project managers, and it does go against the grain, and they're trying to put a project panel together. Put plenty of, collateral in there for time.

Dante Healy [00:37:47]:

And you got a c.

John Byrne [00:37:48]:

Yeah. Contingency. Sorry. Yep. Contingency. That's the I knew it was a c word. I just couldn't remember which one. Put plenty of contingency for time in there because, there will always be something.

John Byrne [00:37:57]:

And and one of the big problems I see with project managers when they're planning together is they they won't put put enough time in. They'd say, well, the last time I was late by a month because somebody got knocked down by a car. Okay? But the time before that, you were late by a month. Yeah. Because somebody caught the flu. Time before that, you know, the the these things won't happen again, and all daily won't happen again, but something else will happen. That it it will invariably if it's any kind of a long term project, there are going to be delays. I would, you know, at least 20%, I would think.

Dante Healy [00:38:31]:

Exactly. The further out you go, the more uncertainty you face.

John Byrne [00:38:36]:

Yeah. Yeah. So build that in, adds their own. It goes against the grain, and you'll have a you know, if if if, your project sponsor cops on that you've just thrown in a load of extra time for contingency, they will fight against it and that. So you'll you'll have to be savvy as to how you fit that in, but do figure it in because if you don't, something will happen and you will be delayed. And there's none of the stuff we discussed here will will fix that if if if it's delayed because somebody's left the job or or something like that that, you know. So one little bit of a tip I've I've come across all my years of experience.

Dante Healy [00:39:12]:

Yeah. Thanks, John. This has been a great discussion. And, yeah, just to wrap up, I guess project delays aren't just about bad planning. The real danger is failing to see the hidden underlying reasons, which could be outdated assumptions, blind faith that more resources will fix the issue, as well as that fear of sunk cost. I guess the best project managers know when to adjust, when to pivot, and when to stop. So, John, anything else before we wrap up

John Byrne [00:39:41]:

on that? I I think, we've we've covered everything there. You know, we we what we were planning with the the episode. I I, you know, the people listening, if, if you are an aspiring or starting out project manager, don't fear failure. Failure is only, you know, if if it's your job to, to to review these things, it's not failure when you review them to turn around and say, okay, this is not working. We have to reassess things. That's not a failure. And so, you know, I'm very good with the projects.

Dante Healy [00:40:12]:

Exactly. Redefine that term failure, especially when you're managing more complex projects because it will be it will be more challenging to determine success. You can't just assume that coming back to what we said previously, scope, schedule, cost are the only measures of success. It's really about outcomes, and that's where exceptional project managers thrive.

John Byrne [00:40:39]:

That's it. And and as you get experience, you'll feel more confident doing it. But even as a junior project manager, if that's what you are or you're planning to get into it, trust yourself.

Dante Healy [00:40:49]:

Thank you, John. And with that, we wrap up this episode of business breaks. Feel free to like and subscribe if you got value, and also visit the website businessbreaks.club. John, thank you very much.

John Byrne [00:41:03]:

Thank you, Dante. I'll see you next time.